Spec8472 wrote:Were_Fan wrote:Most, if not all, of the people incarcerated at Guantanamo were non-uniformed fighters.
Yes.
Were_Fan wrote:Under the Geneva convention they can be killed. Everyone seems to forget that major point of law.
Uhh... I don't see that anywhere.
And you won't. I think what many people miss is that if it is not prohibited in the Geneva Convention, it is allowed. There are also many exclusions such as perfidy (such as faking being wounded, faking surrender) that put you outside the convention's protection. The Gitmo detainees are not in uniform so they initailly are classed as civilians. Article 68 of convention IV states:
"Art. 68. Protected persons who commit an offence which is solely intended to harm the Occupying Power, but which does not constitute an attempt on the life or limb of members of the occupying forces or administration, nor a grave collective danger, nor seriously ..."
Notice the "life or limb" exclusion? As a "civilian", if you make an attempt on the life or limb of an occupying force, you can be whacked. The convention is riddled with these type of exclusions.
http://www.genevaconventions.org/
quick definitions:
sabotage
An occupying power may sentence civilians to death if they are guilty of serious acts of sabotage — but only if these offenses were punishable by death by local laws before the occupation began. (Convention IV, Art. 68)
Yup, Doing things like blowing up restaurants, banks, churches and security checkpoints can get you executed.
spies
Combatant who are captured while spying do not have the right to prisoner of war status unless they were wearing their military uniforms. (Protocol I, Art. 46)
Notice that bit about the uniform?
If you aren't in uniform, you don't get POW status.
Actual excerpts:
Protocol I
Section II
Article 44:
4. A combatant who falls into the power of an adverse Party while failing to meet the requirements set forth in the second sentence of paragraph 3 shall forfeit his right to be a prisoner of war, but he shall, nevertheless, be given protections equivalent in all respects to those accorded to prisoners of war by the Third Convention and by this Protocol. This protection includes protections equivalent to those accorded to prisoners of war by the Third Convention in the case where such a person is tried and punished for any offences he has committed.
Generally applies unless you do something to get you excluded from the protections of the convention. There are a LOT of exclusions.
Art. 47. Mercenaries
1. A mercenary shall not have the right to be a combatant or a prisoner of war.
2. A mercenary is any person who:
(a) is specially recruited locally or abroad in order to fight in an armed conflict;
(b) does, in fact, take a direct part in the hostilities;
(c) is motivated to take part in the hostilities essentially by the desire for private gain and, in fact, is promised, by or on behalf of a Party to the conflict, material compensation substantially in excess of that promised or paid to combatants of similar ranks and functions in the armed forces of that Party;
(d) is neither a national of a Party to the conflict nor a resident of territory controlled by a Party to the conflict;
(e) is not a member of the armed forces of a Party to the conflict; and
(f) has not been sent by a State which is not a Party to the conflict on official duty as a member of its armed forces.
I havn't read all of them, but I don't see even the non-unformed combatants being quite classified as Mercinaries. Even still, the provisions don't provide for them being killed or tortured.
I agree, the combatants are not mercenaries nor should they be tortured. However, when you read all the exclusions, the "detainees" lose many protections afforded to uniformed troops. Detention for the duration of a conflict is expressly allowed. It is well worth it to read the entire Geneva convention. There are a lot of ifs, ands and buts. The Bush administraction is using the exclusions to full advantage.
From
http://www.genevaconventions.org/
Convention I
For the Amelioration of the Condition of the Wounded and Sick in Armed Forces in the Field. Sets forth the protections for members of the armed forces who become wounded or sick.
Convention II
For the Amelioration of the Condition of Wounded, Sick and Shipwrecked Members of Armed Forces at Sea. Extends protections to wounded, sick and shipwrecked members of naval forces.
Convention III
Relative to the Treatment of Prisoners of War, Geneva. Lists the rights of prisoners of war.
Convention IV
Relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War, Geneva. Deals with the protection of the civilian population in times of war.
Protocol I
Additional to the Geneva Conventions of 12 August 1949, and relating to the Protection of Victims of International Armed Conflicts. Extends protections to victims of wars against racist regimes and wars of self determination.
Protocol II
Additional to the Geneva Conventions of 12 August 1949, and relating to the Proection of Victims of Non-International Armed Conflicts. Extends protections to victims of internal conflicts in which an armed opposition controls enough territory to enable them to carry out sustained military operations.
Watch for Haliburton stock in his "blind" trust. Also, Cheney set up so-called deferred compensation plan before becoming VP. Cheney has received over $350,000 from Haliburton while supposedly being true to his oath as US VP. Do you still think there isn't a fire somewhere in all that smoke? Google