Conviction Chapter 9 [Spoilers]

[SoronelHaetir]

I understand why the hallucinations happen, my question is more that it simply seems like too scientific a description for the Parri to employ. I get the sense that the Parri accept the universe as they experience it without trying very hard to explain it.

And I say "strange visions" in the sense that they are different from her normal visions that do in fact tell her things. I could well see a Parri shaman as experiencing hyperspace as some sort of vision but not being able to extract the meaning.

[kyli]

So Fel used the word "hallucinations" instead of "strange visions". Even he can make a mistake sometimes.... if it can can even be called a mistake.

Though i do recall it saying somewhere that the parri are very sensitive to jump shock and that they had to use short jumps when bringing them to Karis, i think.

[Wolfee]

So who or what is the "small point of light" surrounded by darkness? A imprisoned biological mind attached to computer of the command ship? Is it part of the Oracle system as the story has unfolded in the last few chapters seems to have directed the enemy fleet into a trap? Is it some how an original Karinne (highly unlikely - but this is FEL!) mind that has been enslaved, captured by one enemy and stolen by another from the first? Is it an artificial intelligence that is the Oracle system but is hiding its sentience to protect itself from its masters? Or something else?

Looking forward to chapter 10!

[kyli]

I think we all agree that the "small point of light" is whats behind the Oracle system. I find it unlikely that its an AI since it has to have psychic abilities. Biogenics are basicly computers with psychic abilities (they got something very similar to telepathy and telekinesis), but i highly doubt that the syndicate has anything like that. That leaves a biological being that probably isn't a Benga since its imprisoned and not willingly helping. The captured Benga captians said that the Oracle system is a computer that calculates the odds of success though jason believes they were hiding something. This is the biggest reason that i think the Oracle system is really just the name for a system designed to unwillingly extract data from a precogs mind by connecting to the brain in a way similar to how cyberjacks work. The syndicate doesnt have jacks but they do have those machines they use when in hyperspace to put someone in a dreamstate. I think the Oracle system extracts that information from the precogs and calculates the odds of success or failure and what actions are to be taken to achieve success. However, it seems that the precog is now fighting and holding back. That is probably not easy but it probably knows that the karinnes could possibly rescue it, but the consortium never stood a chance of rescuing him/her. So it is managing to hold back information, and those who know anything about math, know that a single missing variable can drastically change change the answer. And i think that the precog is doing everything it can to hide a few variables. So that's my more detailed theory of what the Oracle system is after reading the latest chapter.

[calista241]

I wonder if Fel reads these threads and either gets ideas, or if he laughs at how off base we are.

[kyli]

I wonder if Fel reads these threads and either gets ideas, or if he laughs at how off base we are.

Of course he does.

[SoronelHaetir]

Wasn't there a comment in one of the earlier stories that some of the MW galaxy races already have very rare precognitive individuals? But that the ability drives the person insane?

[SYED]

I hope the oracle system is something House Karrine can adapt and augement for their own uses. I really doubt they would ever support a system that enforces the slavery of some sentient being. As it is a partially a computer system, being augemented by a biogenic computer, potentially even a fully sentient version, would seriously enhance any of its capabilities.
The whole altered mental state/dream state, could similarly be enhanced by the machine mind link, that the jacks provide. It would similarly be allowing them to more easily enter and exit such a reality. It might provide an alternative to full time immersion.

I wonder if the altered mind state might be a way to prevent madness in precogs. Having a way to prevent madness in their precogs help preserve some very valuable assets. It is said that some tele kinetics have barely acknowledge abilities due to how limited their abilities are, so could the same be for pre cogs. Most precogs might just have the occasional lucky hunch. I wonder if biogenics can be boost precog abilities similar to how they do so for telepathy and telekinesis.

[expedient]

Wasn't there a comment in one of the earlier stories that some of the MW galaxy races already have very rare precognitive individuals? But that the ability drives the person insane?

I believe that in one of the previous discussions Fel confirmed that Faey have precogs but that it was rare. I don't remember anything about the ability driving them insane.

[MartinK]

Wasn't there a comment in one of the earlier stories that some of the MW galaxy races already have very rare precognitive individuals? But that the ability drives the person insane?

I believe that in one of the previous discussions Fel confirmed that Faey have precogs but that it was rare. I don't remember anything about the ability driving them insane.

He's right, I remember something like that as well. No wonder, imagine you can see the most probable future - or even one of countless possible futures. How do you act on that knowledge? If you know about something bad happening to this or that person, do you have to stop it from happening? What if helping avoid a small thing results in a bad big thing happening? Or maybe you are so powerful you see the end of your people? Or even your own death. Precognition is one gift I wouldn't want to have no matter what.

Hm, on the other hand, weak precognition may be of help in fighting - without the time to consciously think about your reaction the number of probable futures would shrink enormously if you only see less than a second or two into the future. It is however enough to get a big advantage in anything involving fighting, from hand-to-hand combat to firing laser guns in a fighter.

[kyli]

So to change the subject a bit, the karinnes have two superships now. The one in Andromeda and the one they captured with the boarding party, which was a KMS only operation. The Confederation also now has an additional three mostly intact superships and six superships with varying degrees of damage from the GRAF cannon. I wonder who will end up with these ships. For now, it will be a confederate wide operation to reseach the tech in the ships but which empires will get the ships? My opinion is that the ships will eventually be staffed by every confederate empire and will be the first (and maybe the only) full CCM ships. No empire would own superships, except for the karinnes, who can capture ships personally for their own use. But even this solution has problems, since if you want to arm these ships with the best of the Confederations heavy weapons; most of the empires will want to keep the specs to their most powerful weapons secret and if you put them on a ship shared with the other members of tbe Confederation, then you have basicly have to share the tech. Of course, a supership using weapons that every confederate empire already has is still powerful. Whatever the syndicate already has installed, plus heavy rail cannons, and maybe a few other confederation weapons and you still have a beast of a command ship for the CCM.

[SYED]

I could see low level precog being more widely spread, due to people not knowingly aware they have he gift or even the potential. They might just be hunches or gut instincts working to aid them. High level precogs to survive would need some kind of aid. I am thinking some kind of cloistered retreat or monastery. The simpler the life, the less complex the futures they might perceive.
We know Karrines can exist in two time states at once, I wonder if that means they have potential precog ability. It might allow them an easier time experiencing precognition.

[Wolfee]

So to change the subject a bit, the karinnes have two superships now. The one in Andromeda and the one they captured with the boarding party, which was a KMS only operation. The Confederation also now has an additional three mostly intact superships and six superships with varying degrees of damage from the GRAF cannon. I wonder who will end up with these ships. For now, it will be a confederate wide operation to reseach the tech in the ships but which empires will get the ships? My opinion is that the ships will eventually be staffed by every confederate empire and will be the first (and maybe the only) full CCM ships. No empire would own superships, except for the karinnes, who can capture ships personally for their own use. But even this solution has problems, since if you want to arm these ships with the best of the Confederations heavy weapons; most of the empires will want to keep the specs to their most powerful weapons secret and if you put them on a ship shared with the other members of tbe Confederation, then you have basicly have to share the tech. Of course, a supership using weapons that every confederate empire already has is still powerful. Whatever the syndicate already has installed, plus heavy rail cannons, and maybe a few other confederation weapons and you still have a beast of a command ship for the CCM.

I've thought a bit about this - all the really damaged ships, even the super ships can be scrapped, put them all in Sol system and put folks to work recycling them in to materials for the war effort. There is going to be so much metal to go around that a lot of folks are going to be working for years to scrap and re-use it all. Of the super ships, each of the empires should get one for their own ship yard... they won't be able to use it now, outfitting it would take years, but they've got the hull of the new yard for when the war is over. Ones with no damage at all should be remodeled for mobile expeditionary base ships.

Other you could build huge orbital farms in, piping filtered sunlight in to grow more food for the Confederation and its allies... again going to take years to remodel them...

[SYED]

I could see the refitting of the ships being an academy wide project.

[MartinK]

So to change the subject a bit, the karinnes have two superships now. The one in Andromeda and the one they captured with the boarding party, which was a KMS only operation. The Confederation also now has an additional three mostly intact superships and six superships with varying degrees of damage from the GRAF cannon. I wonder who will end up with these ships. For now, it will be a confederate wide operation to reseach the tech in the ships but which empires will get the ships? My opinion is that the ships will eventually be staffed by every confederate empire and will be the first (and maybe the only) full CCM ships. No empire would own superships, except for the karinnes, who can capture ships personally for their own use. But even this solution has problems, since if you want to arm these ships with the best of the Confederations heavy weapons; most of the empires will want to keep the specs to their most powerful weapons secret and if you put them on a ship shared with the other members of tbe Confederation, then you have basicly have to share the tech. Of course, a supership using weapons that every confederate empire already has is still powerful. Whatever the syndicate already has installed, plus heavy rail cannons, and maybe a few other confederation weapons and you still have a beast of a command ship for the CCM.

I doubt that those giant moon sized ships will ever see action again. Just to crew them would take out a huge bite of any one nations military corps. Since those superships lost the battle, obviously it is best to continue to fight in the way they already do. Much better to have a hundred ships between scout destroyers and battleships rather than a single supership.

I expect that all nations that are heavily invested into the CCM end up with at least one of those superships around their capital planet. There, it will become some sort of space station to base research, training and even system defence on since they are already heavily armored and offer a lot of space. And of course it will be a constant reminder of what brought all those nations together and be a huge boost to the national pride just sitting there.

After a nation gets their hands on one or two of those things taking them apart for resources might become more popular. But I can also see some nations putting up one of those things in every single one of the systems they are holding. Now, keeping them running will be more of a problem... probably mothball most of the supership and just keep a skeleton crew and staff for the areas that will be in use. No nation will be able to actually run those things in battle, they are just too expensive in terms of people and resources needed. No nation can afford it. Or, looking at how easy some of the CCM ships can take them down, want to.