The Galatic Boogeyman?

[boballab]

Thats the thing the Faey would just keep moving further and further out, kind of like a cancer consuming everything in their path. However the Faey at the same time would keep learning, building better ships, better weapons and they would have done it at a faster rate. War has always spurned technology ahead, and if the kimdori hadn't turned the Faey onto themselves to where war amongst themselves became too deadly to be fought to its fullest the Faey would be much more advanced then they are now. Remember most of the Imperial Tech is based on Karinne research and it is the Kimdori influencing them that slowed down Faey advancement.

A sad fact is that the Kimdori not only sat aside and watched the destruction of House Karinne they are the cause of it and not just from turning the Faey onto themselves. The Kimdori knew the Karinnes were becoming obsessed with the Program, and ignoring the rest of Imperium. They had to know both sides wanted Karinne support but they didn't warn the Karinnes, or if they did after so many centuries of letting the Karinnes fall deeper into their obsession they weren't believed.

So yes Kimdori Prime might be safe itself but the Kimdori would have eventually been trapped there with the Faey destroying their ships and not even a Kimdori can survive the cold, hard vacumm of space.

[SYED]

house karinne is the ony interspecies alliance house, that suddernly has a member in line for the imperia throne, soon they wil rise and rule over all mwha hah ha, the kimdori watching over it all

[furry_wolf2001b]

Well, the history of the Faey shows that war is not really all that innovative comparatively.
Sure, making a more effective killing weapon from what you already know is not suppricing at all in war times.
And perhaps improvements on what you have and know elsewhere.
But true inventivness?

Look at funding for one simple facktor, do you want that fleet, or do you want to build a massive hydront mega superstring collider?
Fleet will always be to priority, and same with short range research too, getting a little better thing now or shortly is way more important then something that MABY will have some effect somehow in the future, some when at that.

Just look at what the karines had back then, even the story present day faey have not caght up in most tings.
With a few natural exceptions.

And there we can see the other side of that funding coin, spend all cash on research, and no cash on fleet or such stuff.

(both is exaggerations naturally, as both had some in both fields, but i hope you get mu drift)

And yeah, if there where less competition they may have gotten too huge, but getting that huge tends to solidify resistance.
If a threat is that apparent, i cant see the neighbors not joining forces somewhat.

And it is not the kimdories job to live the lives, or rule the karrines.
They may be your friends and cousins, but it is not your job to correct all their mistakes and always be their support.

And as shown, they may be great spies, but hardly all knowing.
And as said, warnings can be ignored.

[boballab]

Furry funding isn't a factor since all the initial research is military in scope. Here is some things from our own past.

The US government spent a lot of money funding research into Radar in the late 30's and early 40's. The company that did most of the research was the Raytheon Corp. They made a lot of money during WWII selling radar sets to the military but once the war was over the demand dropped. So what do you do? You find other uses for that tech hence Raytheon invented the Microwave oven.

http://www.gallawa.com/microtech/history.html

Now lets take a look at the invention of the computer. Do you know what the first computer was invented for? To calculate artillary trajectories for the US Army. Thats right folks the military are the ones that drove early computer science. We have all heard of "Super Computers" but who do you think drove that research Universities or the CIA/NSA? Again it was the government that did that with the CIA/NSA needing them for code breaking. So again a piece of modern everyday tech came out of Military research

Just look at the two world wars. Airplanes were novelty items before WWI, the Military drove the research on them and by the end of WWI planes made leaps forward. Airplane Tech stalled during the intermining years until just before WWII when people once again started looking for better planes to kill each other with. By the end of WWII we had the first true cargo and passenger planes but the Military didn't need them anymore. From that excess of military equipment came the first airlines and cargo carriers. 1950 saw the Korean war and the need again for better planes and brought us the Jet age. Comericial applications followed in due course. That is how in less then 60 years we went from horse drawn carriage to the Jet age, War.

Cars were the same as planes. Prior to WWII most Americans had never driven a Car before but after seeing what Automobiles could do (read Jeep). When the troops came home after the war the car craze started.

Then there was the whole Space Race tech that was developed that ended up in the private sector.

Now lets look at some Faey Tech.

What do you think the rational to develope the Stargates was commercial or military? More then likey it was Military based on it allowed the Empress to get her fleets from one end of the Empire to the other very quickly, which meant she didn't need as many ships after that. Once you have the stargates she wouldn't need to keep a squadron hovering over almost every planet to keep the Nobles in line. The Commercial side was just a nice bonus.

Composite materials needed to make the Navy ships, gets spun off into commercial shipping and other uses, just like how Composite Materials was first used in the Have Blue project (Stealth) in the 60's. Now Composite Materials have all kinds of commercial uses such as wrapping around Concrete Highway supports in earthquake prone areas.

Empire wide comm systems would have been a must for the Imperial Navy and Government so they would have driven that research, now every Imperial citizen can call anyone across the Imperium.

Just like with our computer research the military would have been in the forefront of computer science.

All you do is look back to Subjugation and look at who was recruiting Jason.

Most of them revolved around Jason’s lack of interest in trying to get placed into Black Ops (where most weapons and top-secret military systems were designed) or R&D (where everything was designed).

“Who are you?” he asked bluntly.
“Lieutenant Commander Lirrin Ulala,” she said, extending a blue hand. “And I’m very excited to meet you, Jason Fox

“Why would you come to see me? I’m just a student.”
“That’s exactly why I came to see you,” she chuckled. “My division handles recruiting students into R&D

R&D researchs everything not just Military systems but the Recruitment officer is a Lt Commander in the Imperial Navy. That ought to tell you something right there that the Faey military has a hand in all research in the Imperium. The Faey system is where the majority of research is funded by the Military and any non secret applications get sold to the Ministary of Technology and companies buy the patent from there. Just think of the Itchers.

Once you develope a Military Tech the company that did it then takes that research and branchs off that to find commercial applications. That is how a lot of high tech goes, you need better systems to fight wars, you fund research, the research makes whatever it is, the company that did the initial research looks for commercial applications off that research. Overall Tech level increases. The Karinnes gave them some old Karinne ideas, the Imperium in the form of R&D and Black Ops branched off that initial research.

[ANTIcarrot]

Oh dear, oh dear. The shameful american propaganda. Bad cultural imperialist! Naughty!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_radar#1900s
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer#H ... _computing
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raytheon#During_WW_II
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microwave_oven#History

The company that did most of the research was the Raytheon Corp.

They were just a construction contractor. America did do a lot of research, after they were given working prototypes by the British. The only thing they (Dr Spencer) discovered was that microwaves could heat food. Only when another company had turned it into a practical design did they buy it and claim it as theirs.

Now lets take a look at the invention of the computer. Do you know what the first computer was invented for?

Examining the problems of wing flutter. Or breaking latter versions of the german enigma code. Depending on who you talk to. The American claim is an urban myth caused by a cover up of other competing claims form a variety of reasons and creative definitions.

[/quote]the Military drove the research on [aircraft][/quote]

As did civilian aerial racing and stunt work. The germans dismissed the spitfire when they first saw because it looked too much like a fancy racer, rather than a real war plane; unlike their fully military developed Me109. Point of fact the UK military didn't think too much of it either at first.

By the end of WWII we had the first true cargo and passenger planes but the Military didn't need them anymore.

Also at the end of WWII we have a few interesting tales.
*The supersonic jet prototype M.52 was destroyed; its capacity not to be duplicated for more than ten years. A military decision.
*Advanced british computers were all destroyed, with only a handful of pieces surviving, for 'military reasons'.
*In the rubble of Berlin american soldiers successfully find german magnetic tape, developed for civilian radio broadcasts, not military use.
*After plowing in technical expertise and personnel, the results of the joint Anglo American Canadian Manhattan project are ceased by the americans, who proceed to write everyone else out of history.

And in the decades to follow:
*A british white paper almost destroys the british aerospace industry
*American military shuts down a german stealth fighter programme more advanced than anything they will build for another twenty years.

Then there was the whole Space Race tech that was developed that ended up in the private sector.

*Military foolishness in Vietnam put an end to the Saturn V
*When congress fails to cough up the money needed for the shuttle, military requirements doom it to being an unreliable expensive deathtrap.

Empire wide comm systems would have been a must for the Imperial Navy and Government so they would have driven that research, now every Imperial citizen can call anyone across the Imperium.

In the british empire a similar network was built for administration, not for military advantage.

R&D researchs everything not just Military systems

At this point in the story Jason has to be considered an unreliable narrator. This is what he thinks, not what is actually true. Much of what he believes changes later; hence nothing can be taken as absolute truth.

Once you develope a Military Tech the company that did it then takes that research and branchs off that to find commercial applications.

Or the other way round. Many civilian applications might have come from nuclear power plants, but they and the bombs came from civilian research. E=MC2 was not a military equation after all.

[boballab]

Anti your facts are so far off I guess you didn't research it.

Radar:

Nikola Tesla, in August 1917, proposed principles regarding frequency and power levels for primitive radar units. In the 1917 The Electrical Experimenter, Tesla stated the principles in detail:

"For instance, by their [standing electromagnetic waves] use we may produce at will, from a sending station, an electrical effect in any particular region of the globe; [with which] we may determine the relative position or course of a moving object, such as a vessel at sea, the distance traversed by the same, or its speed."
Tesla also proposed the use of these standing electromagnetic waves along with pulsed reflected surface waves to determine the relative position, speed, and course of a moving object and other modern concepts of radar.

Tesla became a US citizen in 1891 and lived and worked the rest of his life in the US

Naval Research Laboratory
In the autumn of 1922, Albert H. Taylor and Leo C. Young of the U.S. Naval Research Laboratory (NRL) were conducting communication experiments when they noticed that a wooden ship in the Potomac River was interfering with their signals; in effect, they had demonstrated the first continuous wave (CW) interference radar with separated transmitting and receiving antennas. In June, 1930, Lawrence A. Hyland of the NRL in the U.S. detected an airplane with this type of radar operating on 33 MHz.

After early U.S. work on radar conducted in the twenties at the Naval Research Laboratories, the success of Robert Page's pulsed radar experiment in 1934 redirected the attention of the Signal Corps, who had been focusing more on use of sound and heat to detect aircraft. Expertise in radio equipment design by the signal corps led to rapid development of an early type of VHF radar at Fort Monmouth and Camp Evans in New Jersey for use with coastal artillery .

Radar arrangement on the aircraft carrier Lexington, 1944 By 1940 when the British and US began technology exchanges, the British were surprised to learn they were not unique in their possession of practical pulse radar technology. The U.S. Navy's pulse radar system, the CXAM radar was found to be very similar in capability to their Chain Home technology.

As clearly shown Radar research started in the US well before and independtly from Great Britian. Also note early research was done by the US Navy. Then you grossly understated Raytheons contributions to Radar research and development which continues still today. Also another company didn't develope the Microwave oven, Raytheon bought a refridgerator company and sold the Microwave oven, that they developed under that brand name

At war's end in 1945 the company was responsible for about 80 percent of all magnetrons manufactured. During the war Raytheon also pioneered the production of shipboard radar systems, particularly for submarine detection.
Raytheon's research on the magnetron tube revealed the potential of microwaves to cook food. In 1945 Raytheon's Percy Spencer invented the microwave oven by discovering that the magnetron could rapidly heat food. In 1947 the company demonstrated the Radarange microwave oven for commercial use.

Raytheon is a developer and manufacturer of radars (including AESAs), electro-optical sensors, and other advanced electronics systems for airborne, naval and ground based military applications.

In 1965 it acquired Amana Refrigeration, Inc., a manufacturer of refrigerators and air conditioners. Using the Amana brand name and its distribution channels, Raytheon began selling the first countertop household microwave oven in 1967 and became a dominant manufacturer in the microwave oven business.

US based manufacturers of the AESA radars used in the F22 and Super Hornet include Northrop Grumman[1] and Raytheon.[2] These companies also design, develop and manufacture the transmit/receive modules which comprise the 'building blocks' of an AESA radar. The requisite electronics technology was developed in-house via Department of Defense research programs such as MIMIC Program.[3][4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_Ele ... nned_Array

It's fine to have pride in your UK heritage but don't reach for what you don't have.

Computers:

ENIAC, short for Electronic Numerical Integrator And Computer,[1][2] was the first general-purpose electronic computer. It was the first Turing-complete, digital computer capable of being reprogrammed to solve a full range of computing problems,[3] although earlier machines had been built with some of these properties. ENIAC was designed and built to calculate artillery firing tables for the U.S. Army's Ballistic Research Laboratory.

There was devices before it but not a computer. What was used by the British was even classified by Alan Turing himself as not a computer and he invented it. Also this device that Turing built was still military driven since the Enigma machines were used by the German Military.

Colossus was the first totally electronic computing device. The Colossus used a large number of valves (vacuum tubes). It had paper-tape input and was capable of being configured to perform a variety of boolean logical operations on its data, but it was not Turing-complete

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ENIAC
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of ... g_hardware

There is only one competitor to Eniac in 1939:

1939: John J. Atanasoff designs a prototype for the ABC (Atanasoff-Berry Computer) with the help of graduate student Clifford Berry at Iowa State College. In 1973 a judge ruled it the first automatic digital computer.

http://www.cyberstreet.com/hcs/museum/chron.htm

There is debate if the ABC is Turing Complete.

Turing completeness
A computational system that can compute every Turing-computable function is called Turing-complete (or Turing-powerful). Alternatively, such a system is one that can simulate a universal Turing machine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turing_complete

Airplanes:

You seem to conviently overlook the time between the Wrights first flight and the 1920's when aerial racing became popular. Prior to WWI Racing wasn't big and what was done was all centered on speed nothing else. WWI was were the real developement happened. Stunt Work? Hello just like I said a curiosity it was not taken seriously outside of the US Postal service and the Worlds militaries.

About ten years after the Wright brothers made the first powered flight, there was still much to be improved upon. Because of limitations of the engine power of the time, the effective payload of aircraft was extremely limited

In 1911, Captain Bertram Dickson, the first British military officer to fly, also correctly prophesied the military use of aircraft. He predicted aircraft would first be used for reconnaissance, but this would develop into each side trying to "hinder or prevent the enemy from obtaining information", which would eventually turn into a battle for control of the skies. This is exactly the sequence of events that would occur several years later.[1]

The first operational use of aircraft in war took place on 23 October 1911 in the Italo-Turkish War, when Captain Carlo Piazza made history’s first reconnaissance flight near Benghazi in a Blériot XI.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_I_Aviation

[edit] First performances steps under World War I (1914 - 1918)
Main article: World War I Aviation
German Taube monoplane, illustration from 1917Almost as soon as they were invented, planes were drafted for military service.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aviation_h ... orld_War_I

All of the major forces in Europe had light aircraft, typically derived from pre-war sporting designs, attached to their reconnaissance departments.

useful load. First aircrafts were single seated, with just sufficient load for pilote and some fuel. While early efforts were hampered by the light loads carried, improved two-seat designs soon appeared that were entirely practical. At the end of the war, there was bombers and long range aircrafts.
Range and speed progression. To be developped.

Before blaming the Vietnam war for the cancelation of the Saturn V maybe you should look at Johnson's "Great Society". The Vietnam war ended in 1973 the Great Society continued. Example of this was that the welfare system Johnson invented has costed over 6 trillion dollars alone unill ended in 1995. Everyone loves to look at the military when it comes to the US Budget and true as a single line item it is the largest single item, however The Great Society was spread over multiple line items in the budget and far outstripped Military spending. Johnson deliberatly mislead congress and the people what the Pentagon was telling him in 1965. He also kept the Military advisors away from his domestic advisors. In 1965 the Pentagon told him to reach a stalemate in Vietnam it would take 500,000 troops. Johnson deliberately from there did not tell the public that or congress because he didn't want any reduction on his Great Society that he pushed through in 1964. Johnson tried to do the Vietnam war on the cheap, in 1967-68 the military almost went broke because Johnson was sure the war in Vietnam would be over by christmas. They had to pass stop gap spending to cover the cost but Great Society kept right on rolling. After the war the military budget took a hit so there should have been money for space then by your theory but there wasn't it went to more Great Society spending.

E=MC2 is not research it is a mathmatical formula that was part of a theory. Research is what you do to prove a theory. Tying E=MC2 to the atomic bomb is tenous at best.

While E=mc2 is useful for understanding the amount of energy released in a fission reaction, it was not strictly necessary to develop the weapon. As the physicist and Manhattan Project participant Robert Serber put it: "Somehow the popular notion took hold long ago that Einstein's theory of relativity, in particular his famous equation E=mc2, plays some essential role in the theory of fission. Albert Einstein had a part in alerting the United States government to the possibility of building an atomic bomb, but his theory of relativity is not required in discussing fission. The theory of fission is what physicists call a non-relativistic theory, meaning that relativistic effects are too small to affect the dynamics of the fission process significantly."[54] However the association between E=mc2 and nuclear energy has since stuck, and because of this association, and its simple expression of the ideas of Albert Einstein himself, it has become "the world's most famous equation".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass-energy_equivalence

[ANTIcarrot]

Anti your facts are so far off I guess you didn't research it.
It's fine to have pride in your UK heritage but don't reach for what you don't have.

Let's see. I provided sources, and you provided sources, and they disagreed. So I must be wrong? Funny how that works.

ENIAC, short for Electronic Numerical Integrator And Computer

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer#H ... _computing
"Zuse Z3 (Germany) May 1941 Binary Electro-mechanical Program-controlled by punched film stock (turing capable?) Yes (proven - 1998)"

That would be four years before the american claim. Next time please read the sources I list before calling me an idiot.That goes double for reading your own sources! From the wikipedia page you quoted on Turing completeness:

"Charles Babbage's analytical engine (1830s) would have been the first Turing-complete machine if it had been built at the time it was designed, but the first actual implementation of a Turing-complete machine appeared in 1941: the program-controlled Z3 of Konrad Zuse. The universality of the Z3 was presented by Raúl Rojas in 1998. Prior to Rojas' 1998 paper, the first machine known to be Turing-complete was ENIAC (1946)."

I'm trying to make two points here:
1) I strongly disagree with you assertion that the military is the sole or even majority source of new technology or new applications.

2) American history books written by American for Americans are usually based on other American History Books written by Americans for Americans. They are full of errors, exaggerations and outright flattery because they almost never seek to check their version of history against anything else. I'm not saying that you're the only ones who do that (as you point out we like to do it about radar, and don't get me started on islamic claims...) but you're the most blatant about it because of the whole vast media empire thing. And I am not repeating something a friend once told me. This is stuff I've *seen* time and again in American books in my areas of expertise. It's like watching exam cheats. They keep making the same mistakes, keep forgetting the same inconvenient facts, and keep not asking the same awkward questions. That's not how history works. It might have happened only once but it gets witnessed endlessly. The versions should mismatch. If they don't there's something wrong. I'm not particularly getting at Americans here, so much as trying to explain why popular history (in books or other formats) and things based on popular history (like wikipedia) are not terribly reliable.

3) Look at the 5th gen fighter controversy surrounding the F-22. Oh what a convenient definition that excludes every other competitor on the planet. America wins by default and semantics. <sarcasm>At the end of WWII all radar was british derived. Hence what you built before that couldn't have been proper radar, could it?</sarcasm> If you disagree a challenge: Ask a friend the name of the first pair of brothers who were the first to achieve manned flight. How many of them would just assume you mean manned, heavier than air powered controlled flight? Like you have below.

Stunt Work? Hello just like I said a curiosity it was not taken seriously outside of the US Postal service and the Worlds militaries.

A curiosity that made money. And won prizes. That and the US postal service again undermines your military source of technology argument. And the whole lighter than air flight, which had been in development for a little while before that.

The first operational use of aircraft in war took place on 23 October 1911 in the Italo-Turkish War, when Captain Carlo Piazza made history’s first reconnaissance flight near Benghazi in a Blériot XI.

Did it indeed? You'll be wanting to severely edit this page then:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of ... ballooning

E=MC2 is not research it is a mathmatical formula that was part of a theory.

True enough. But again it (and all the other civilian research that DID lead to the idea of a bomb) still stands as a counterpoint to theory of military R&D being the font of all knowledge and technology.

[SYED]

There are two reasons why the faey do not expand, the first the houses are a competing with each other, the second was that it was feared that the imperium would be seen as a threat to the other empires forceing to band together and fight if they were going all conquesting, but with the skaa, alliance as enemies, indictors protecting space, consortium attacking places, the imperium could grow as systems join out of fear, want of proection, aid due to attacks, or places conquered in battle.
just wondering if a gate was placed in andromeda, would it stil be intant travel.
also it is said that the faey are not the most advanced some where in the story just powerful with their space and their technology and a threat due to the telepathy. but the thing is the kimdori can go any where and they been around for ages, they should have been abe to gather all those technological secrets, were they givern to the karrine for their database, possible, but there is the threats aimed at house karinne can they hold back anymore.
aso i am looking for the place where i read about the origins of the faey. they are acually from earth an early form of humans that were transplanted by aliens, long ago. it is siad they developed telapathy to compete with with other species us.

[dellstart]

Anti your facts are so far off I guess you didn't research it.
It's fine to have pride in your UK heritage but don't reach for what you don't have.

Let's see. I provided sources, and you provided sources, and they disagreed. So I must be wrong? Funny how that works.

ENIAC, short for Electronic Numerical Integrator And Computer

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer#H ... _computing
"Zuse Z3 (Germany) May 1941 Binary Electro-mechanical Program-controlled by punched film stock (turing capable?) Yes (proven - 1998)"

That would be four years before the american claim. Next time please read the sources I list before calling me an idiot.That goes double for reading your own sources! From the wikipedia page you quoted on Turing completeness:

"Charles Babbage's analytical engine (1830s) would have been the first Turing-complete machine if it had been built at the time it was designed, but the first actual implementation of a Turing-complete machine appeared in 1941: the program-controlled Z3 of Konrad Zuse. The universality of the Z3 was presented by Raúl Rojas in 1998. Prior to Rojas' 1998 paper, the first machine known to be Turing-complete was ENIAC (1946)."

I'm trying to make two points here:
1) I strongly disagree with you assertion that the military is the sole or even majority source of new technology or new applications.

2) American history books written by American for Americans are usually based on other American History Books written by Americans for Americans. They are full of errors, exaggerations and outright flattery because they almost never seek to check their version of history against anything else. I'm not saying that you're the only ones who do that (as you point out we like to do it about radar, and don't get me started on islamic claims...) but you're the most blatant about it because of the whole vast media empire thing. And I am not repeating something a friend once told me. This is stuff I've *seen* time and again in American books in my areas of expertise. It's like watching exam cheats. They keep making the same mistakes, keep forgetting the same inconvenient facts, and keep not asking the same awkward questions. That's not how history works. It might have happened only once but it gets witnessed endlessly. The versions should mismatch. If they don't there's something wrong. I'm not particularly getting at Americans here, so much as trying to explain why popular history (in books or other formats) and things based on popular history (like wikipedia) are not terribly reliable.

3) Look at the 5th gen fighter controversy surrounding the F-22. Oh what a convenient definition that excludes every other competitor on the planet. America wins by default and semantics. <sarcasm>At the end of WWII all radar was british derived. Hence what you built before that couldn't have been proper radar, could it?</sarcasm> If you disagree a challenge: Ask a friend the name of the first pair of brothers who were the first to achieve manned flight. How many of them would just assume you mean manned, heavier than air powered controlled flight? Like you have below.

Stunt Work? Hello just like I said a curiosity it was not taken seriously outside of the US Postal service and the Worlds militaries.

A curiosity that made money. And won prizes. That and the US postal service again undermines your military source of technology argument. And the whole lighter than air flight, which had been in development for a little while before that.

The first operational use of aircraft in war took place on 23 October 1911 in the Italo-Turkish War, when Captain Carlo Piazza made history’s first reconnaissance flight near Benghazi in a Blériot XI.

Did it indeed? You'll be wanting to severely edit this page then:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of ... ballooning

E=MC2 is not research it is a mathmatical formula that was part of a theory.

True enough. But again it (and all the other civilian research that DID lead to the idea of a bomb) still stands as a counterpoint to theory of military R&D being the font of all knowledge and technology.

What has never been doubted, has never been proven.
Denis Diderot 1713-1784, French radical Enlightenment philosopher and Chief Editor of the Encyclopédie, in 'Pensées Philosophique'(1746)

[Spec8472]

Play nice, kids.